Arizona Cattle Rancher on Why Beef Prices Soared While Ranchers Got Crushed During COVID

Vance Crowe [00:00:03] As the crow flies on the Vans Crow podcast. Ashley Mortimer, welcome to the podcast. Thank

Ashlee Mortimer [00:00:12] You.

Vance Crowe [00:00:13] So you are one of, I think, the coolest people that I've met in the last few years. A couple of months ago, you and I met at the Arizona Farm Bureau and you invited me to come give a talk. And when you find, when you sent over the terms, I was like, Hey, my price is a little higher than what you guys were thinking. And so we threw out some crazy ideas and I eventually was like, well, I think because of Coronavirus it's harder to get beef. So what would be more valuable to me is if I could get beef instead of cash. And crazily enough, you went back to your people and figured out a way to be like, all right, we're not gonna pay cash, we're gonna play it in beef because you represent the Arizona Cattle growers or you're a, you're a communications person for them. So I think you are one of the most innovative, interesting, entrepreneurial people out there. And I could not be more excited than having you on my podcast today.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:01:10] Well, thank you. That was way too many compliments for one, one sentence, but I appreciate it. And yeah, we were so excited to be able to uniquely work with you to figure out how to make it work for both of us. And I think that's a exciting part of what my job is at Arizona Cattle Growers is thinking out of the box and thinking of ways that aren't very common to make what both people, both parties want to make happen.

Vance Crowe [00:01:36] So most people have no idea that there is even a thing called the Arizona Cattle Growers or like who do you represent? How do you, what do you do all day?

Ashlee Mortimer [00:01:47] So we are a nonprofit grassroots organization and we represent ranchers all over the state of Arizona. So we actually have thousands of ranchers that are our members that pay dues to us and we represent them at the state capitol, at the during legislative issues and topics at the Department of Agriculture nationally at the capital and Washington DC and the president's office. So we wanna give those ranchers and the people that we're representing a voice when otherwise they wouldn't be able to have that voice because they're on their ranch raising beef and protecting the environment. So that's one part of what Arizona cattle growers is. Another part is communicating with the public and showing and telling what a rancher story is and what ranchers do and the story of, of people's beef. And then another part is educating those ranchers about better and new ways to raise cattle and care for the environment. So we kind of have three different pillars that we're working on and all are to promote and protect ranching and beef in our food supply.

Vance Crowe [00:02:53] So most people will listen to this as opposed to watch it, but if they are watching it, they will see that just over your left shoulder are some goats hanging out. Where are you?

Ashlee Mortimer [00:03:04] So my family has a farm and a ranch in Yavapai County, Arizona and Prescott area. And so because of Coronavirus, I get to work from the ranch every day, which is so much better than working in the office. I get to experience every day what we are fighting for and what I'm promoting and get to go out and help my dad and help my parents and be a part of raising cattle and caring for the environment. And unfortunately at the ranch, we don't have good phone service. So I came over to the farm, which is an agritourism farm where we invite the public to come pick food and meet farmers and meet ranchers. And so that's where I'm sitting right now. This is actually our fire pit area. So I'm sitting on the grass and the goats are behind me and we're just hanging out.

Vance Crowe [00:03:49] So cattle ranchers right now are in the middle of many, many tweet storms going on because people are saying they're the packing plants are being shut down. I had a chance to talk with a pork packing plant, but there are also cattle ranchers that are saying, Hey, the boxed price for beef is going way up, and yet cattle ranchers are getting really low prices. There's something wrong with the market. So just from your standpoint, what is going on in the wild world of politics and cattle raising right now?

Ashlee Mortimer [00:04:24] So I think a silver lining of coronavirus is bringing to light what is happening in the cattle market, and quite frankly, unfair prices and unfair market. It's been happening for quite a long time and I think it'll continue to happen long after Coronavirus is gone. But thankfully the public is now seeing what is happening. And I think that's what we need is that buy-in from the public to help make a difference. So right now, I looked up our prices so that I'm most accurate. On most recent prices on Wednesday, the processors were selling beef to the grocery stores for $4 and 49 cents a pound that is 16% higher than Friday. And ranchers on that same day were receiving 95 cents a pound when they were selling their live cattle, which is a 30% decrease from a few months ago. So when demand is up, people want beef, people want protein in their diets and want to have a steak in that normalized meal for their families. And yet prices are increasing and that isn't funneling down to the rancher. And to us,

Vance Crowe [00:05:33] How do prices get set? I mean, how in in the world of cattle there are people buying at different points in time and how does all that get set up?

Ashlee Mortimer [00:05:43] So it's a very, very complex market and a complex way to set up prices. Part of, or I guess the easiest part that I wanna explain that has to is 85% of the cattle that are raised in the country are taken to four major meat packing facilities. And those, that 85% is then taken to grocery stores and restaurants and huge larger scale places. And that's really where the mass majority of people are getting their beef is restaurants, grocery stores and fast food places. And that's where that beef is coming from, those four major packers. So when four people are able to essentially tell ranchers, no, we're not gonna pay more than this, ranchers don't have anywhere else to take that 85% of their beef, the other percentage of their beef, they can sell to smaller, smaller places or take it to local processing plants and sell it to people in their communities. However, it's much more expensive to get cattle processed in smaller processing plants. And those smaller processing plants don't have the facilities to take that 85% of beef that would be processed in a larger packing facility. So really to answer your question, it's that's a major part of how prices are, are figured out is that people, those processing plants tell the ranchers, this is how much we're willing to pay and you don't wanna pay, then there's nowhere else to take them.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:07:25] Well,

Vance Crowe [00:07:26] And it's a fascinating time right now because there are people that would pay a lot more than they ordinarily would have in order to have a half a, a steer in their, in their freezer right now. So I have some good friends that have found a way to continue to allow butchering to happen, and they were just offered $3,600 for a single steer, which if they had, wow, if they had done that through the commodity prices, you'd have to sell a lot more cows in order to make up that, that amount of price. But there are people right now that are saying, I go to the grocery store and it looks like the supplies are dwindling, so I'm gonna go outside of the system. But the challenge, like you mentioned was there's only so many local butcher shops, there's only so many local lockers, and I'm hearing reports that people are spread all the way out till October, even January, to be able to get their cuts done. And so the, the backup system that's always been out there is nowhere near enough to be able to soak up all the added beef that's in the system and, and it's just creating some interesting situations.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:08:32] Yeah, I totally agree. And another part of this that I think is interesting is when you're getting beef processed at a local butcher and then buying it directly from the rancher, that beef is frozen. So people have to learn a different way to cook the beef when usually ordinarily you'll go into the grocery store and buy raw beef and that's easier and a different mindset of how to cook. So it's almost like learning, learning a different, a different way to cook a different product because now it's frozen.

Vance Crowe [00:09:00] I guess I didn't realize that. So I cook almost all of my beef using a method called sous V. Are you familiar with this?

Ashlee Mortimer [00:09:07] No, I've never heard of it. What is that?

Vance Crowe [00:09:09] So sous V is, it means under vacuum and what it is is you take a freezer bag, one that is thicker with its plastic, and you put the beef in that and you put a little bit of oil in there and whatever seasonings you want, and then you dunk it in water. So it forces out all of the air outside of the bag. Okay. Then you put that water at a bath temperature. So I have a little like appliance that I put into this water bath and it runs the, the water temperature at 135 degrees. So I can put a frozen steak in and put it in the soused for 45 minutes to four hours and it comes out and the temperature of the steak has only ever been 1 35. So it's perfectly medium rare all the way through it. And then you take it out and you throw it on the grill just to get that charred, you know, taste and flavor. Okay. And you have the most perfectly cooked steak you've, you've ever had.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:10:00] Oh my gosh, I'm gonna have to try it. I love that.

Vance Crowe [00:10:04] And the reason I bring this up is because that the frozen pro, I don't even have to think ahead to thaw things out when I have frozen, actually frozen beef from you guys. I had a New York strip last night,

Ashlee Mortimer [00:10:16] How was it?

Vance Crowe [00:10:16] Oh man. You know, the craziest thing in the world that I did not know when I was only eating grocery store beef is that beef raised on grass or pasture tastes different depending on where it comes from. It's like terroir for wine and like people can be like, I either like grass fed or I like grain fed, but it's way more nuanced than that because it's, this tastes like this part of Arizona. So to me this is like our deal has been far more colorful than anything I've ever done before because I'm able to actually transport my mind and be like, this is what this plane, this high desert tastes like.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:10:59] I love it. Yeah, that's so awesome. And I, I agree with you. It's, I think no matter where you get your beef and if you like it grassed or grain fed or all the other interesting labeling that are on it now, it's healthy and it's nutrition, it's safe, but that flavor is what differentiates. And I think it's fun to be able to taste different things and pick up what flavor you like best. And no, no matter what flavor you want, no matter what taste you like best, it all is safe and nutritious.

Vance Crowe [00:11:30] Interesting thing about Coronavirus is that I think it has forced all Americans for the first time to look at where we are on the food chain. And I think like when you can always go to the grocery store and eat at any level you want, you don't think about it very much. But if you go there and the, and the refrigerator section with beef and pork and chicken is running low, all of a sudden you start to remember like, wait a second, I have been at the top of the food chain for my entire life. Although it isn't magic that I'm there, like there is a system built and put in place that helped me eat at the top of the food chain, even if I don't know a single rancher out in the world.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:12:14] Yeah. And I, I totally agree. I think that a lot of that's kind of where we're going back to the silver lining I was talking about earlier of coronavirus. We as ranchers and farmers for a very long time have been knowing that the public wants to know more about where their food comes from and how it's grown and how it's raised. But that disconnect has been there of how do we take that information and provide it for the consumer. And this coronavirus, the silver lining is that now we are able to bring that disconnect closer and bring the two parties closer and be able to transfer that information. And people that thought beef was just magically appeared in the back of the grocery store now are thinking, wait, where does this actually come from? How does it actually grow? Where, what's going on? How does it get here?

Vance Crowe [00:13:02] You know, it seems to me like a person, like you would typically be in a big city, you'd be working at an ad firm, you'd be in New York, or you'd be jetting around to LA or wherever. It strikes me as odd that you are in Arizona, you know, like I'm working on a ranch and I think most of all what strikes me as odd was I've asked a lot of people to come up with creative deals before and almost none of them take me up on it. But like, you really ran with this. So it tells me that like something something's different about you. Tell me about like where were you raised, how did you come to this mindset?

Ashlee Mortimer [00:13:41] So I was actually raised right here. This is my, like we were talking about before, this is my family's farm and our ranch is just 10 miles down the road. And this is where I grew up and I have a huge gigantic, extremely flavorful passion for agriculture and for where foods grown and how it's grown. And growing up, I, my family was involved in farm bureau and cattle growers and being able to see ranchers and see farmers and know that everybody, not just my parents, were dedicated to the environment and caring for the land and wanted the best for their animals and wanted to preserve natural resources. That is where my passion and my spark I guess grew from. And I think growing up in agriculture allowed me to think outside the box and think of, I guess I'm not a person that likes the word no and I'm not, I try to figure out every way to make whatever I want happen, happen, even if there's outside obstacles telling me, no, that's, that's not gonna work. And so because of that, you have to think outside of the box to get everybody on board and make sure that everybody buys into whatever that thing that I wanted do. And so that able grown and flourished because of agriculture and because of the positions that my family put me in. And at a young age, I had to run different employees and manage different people and pay the bills and be the accounts payable person and help with the marketing for the farm. And so because of all those things that normal kids my age weren't doing, I was forced to grow up and to be able to learn and think way differently than normal.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:15:15] People have to think.

Vance Crowe [00:15:17] Yeah, I mean, like I'm struck by, so I work with a lot of the type of person that I was describing, and they're not bad people, but they're one, not empowered to make decisions. And two, even if they were, I find that a lot of times what people want is they want everyone to smile and say that they're getting along, but that at the end of the day, it's really people are only getting along if they're doing business together or if they're making a sacrifice for something in the future that the group wants together. And that's what I think is actually really special about what you and and your, your sidekick summer have done. Was that, was that you guys figured out, like it wasn't just, Hey, let's make the guy that we're trying to get to come to our event happy with it. You had to go get the support of people within your organization. And that takes patience and enthusiasm. Like it's, it's not common, but I actually think probably one of the most valuable skills a human being could have.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:16:12] And to be quite honest, it was very hard to get everybody's buy-in. A lot of people were like, no, that's not gonna work. Or what if, what if he gets sick and we get thrown out and sued? I'm like, Hey guys, we're gonna get this beef, beef processed in a retail facility, USDA certified, I know these people, I know these people are members. So it's bringing a bunch of people together with a common goal of, okay, we want Vance to be our speaker, we want this outcome, how can we make it happen? And I realized a lot with cattle growers that it's almost like on the front side, before I even bring up the idea, I need to have every single answer and everything figured out so I can say, Hey, okay, board, this is my plan, this is every single step and how every part's gonna work. And then they're more likely to say yes, because if I go at 'em with, oh, we're gonna somehow get beef all the what ifs and the oh no, that can't happen, come out instead of No, this is the plan of how we're gonna make it work.

Vance Crowe [00:17:12] You know? And I was on the other side of this imagining that my wife who's pregnant, I want her like, you know, I think about now eating at the top of the food chain. And I, and it's a funny thing because coronavirus has made us say, what do we actually believe? What do you actually think? Because your actions represent what you actually think. So in my mind, I was saying the best thing that I could possibly do for my child would be to make sure we have beef. That's the thing that I want my wife to eat a lot of. I want her to drink a bunch of milk, I want her to have fresh vegetables, but those are the things that I want. But I think if I had been in your position, I am not that good at getting that kind of common buy-in. And I think it's a really important skill to be able to think about not being resentful of people that throw up roadblocks that say, no, that can't be done, but instead figuring out how do you make them comfortable? Because it's oftentimes the people that throw up the roadblocks when you do get them to take them down, then they are your biggest supporters, the most wind in your sails. It's, but I think it's a skill that, because most people are now working in giant bureaucracies, they don't have the power, they don't feel the power to try and go bring people on board with stuff. They kind of say direction comes down from the top and I do what I'm told. And so to me, in a moment of coronavirus finding out there are people like you out there makes me feel like this is the actual American spirit.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:18:38] So going back to what you said about the, this is what I have to do, this is what I was told when I was in college, I, one of my teachers, his name's Dr. Mars, I was sitting in his class and he was telling us that. And me and one of my friends said, heck no, that's not how we're gonna be in in business and in our jobs and in our careers. And he was arguing with us of, well, you can't tell your bosses how it's gonna be. And I said, well, I sure hope I have a boss and a group of people that I'm working with that allow collaboration and brainstorming and, and he just was not letting it go. And now we went back to him and saw him a few years ago and said, Hey, we gotta that point where we were able to collaborate with our bosses and, but like you said, it's not a normal thing. And thankfully I found a position and have been surrounded in agriculture where I think that a lot of people have that mindset of we need to collaborate and it doesn't matter if I'm 40 years older than her, or if I am way, have way more money, or if I'm the boss and she's not. It's bringing people together and everybody thinks differently and everybody has different mindset and everybody wants something different. And so to bring those people together to make something better than any one person could make is, is an awesome part of, of the industry and a thing that I can be a part of, which is awesome.

Vance Crowe [00:20:03] So who would you be if you weren't a cattle person, right? Like this, it seems like it defines you through and through from the moment we met to the work that you're doing to where you're spending coronavirus. But imagine a an alternate world where you were not in cattle. What do you think you'd be doing right now?

Ashlee Mortimer [00:20:20] So I thought about this a lot and I think that I could either be a very hippie dippy, oh, I'm getting a call. Is it good? Yeah,

Vance Crowe [00:20:30] We're good.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:20:30] I got a call and then, okay, cool. I, in high school I would go to like wild flower and see the girls with the like lavender colored hair and dreadlocks and be like, oh, I could be like that and go hiking all the time. And then I'm, or I, so that's one way that I'm like, oh, I could be like that. And then I also love New York City, I love the fastness of it and getting on the subway and going to another part of town that's totally different and going to Chinatown and seeing all of these different people in different cultures all together. So I love to travel and I love to see those things and think, oh, that would be a fun life to have. But I like to be able to come home and come back to the farm and come back to the ranch and come back to my roots and healthcare for the environment. And I mean, I've been saying that a lot, but I think that that's really the foundation of what agriculture is, farmers and ranchers, they just want to make our world better and make sure that we can pass it on to generations to come. So although it would be so awesome to always live in my travels and always be able to be in those fast paced, fast paced places, I love to be able to come back and be grounded again,

Vance Crowe [00:21:43] Grounded again. Yeah. It strikes me when I, I am, if I'm ever asked by a younger person, like what is the job advice or what should I do after school? My my point of view has always been, go find the place that needs you the most, right? Like you can go towards the prestige, you can go towards the Fortune 500 or the big name shiny large organizations, but when you get hired into a place like that, they've got a slot and they're gonna fill you into that slot and you can maybe expand slightly outta that, but you're really only gonna incrementally move up. Whereas if you go to a place where they're like, everything's burning down, you're gonna wear this hat today and that hat tomorrow, then as soon as you're able to get your footing, you can say, all right, I get my work done and now I see another problem and I'm gonna grab that one and solve it and I'm gonna grab another one and solve it. And before you know it, you are really expanding your skillset and everybody around you in that organization is like, thank God this young person showed up to fix these problems instead of being the young person that knows they could be doing more at a large corporation. And everybody thinks, oh, look at the complainer, they're not moving fast enough. But they don't have opportunities to move when you're in those high shiny places.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:22:54] Exactly. And I think a lot of bringing in and being able to say, oh, I have this job, but I can help with this and do what you're saying, it gives your job more excitement because it's not fun to just sit at a desk all day and type the same thing or put in the same bill or make the same report. It's much more fun and brain exhilarating to be able to do a lot of other things and solve problems and make projects. And so yeah, I totally agree. And ever since I was young, I wanted that kind of job. I didn't want to sit at an office and do the same thing every single day. I wanted to be able to do something different and unique and have a fun time at work. And because of those things, you're able to think that work isn't work because it's what you like to do and it's, it's fun and it's exciting.

Vance Crowe [00:23:46] What's the difference between the way the purple haired hippie that travels around is thinking about coronavirus and the way that you are thinking about coronavirus?

Ashlee Mortimer [00:23:57] So my, my outlook on coronavirus is a lot different than a lot of other people. I think that the lavender, hippie colored hair lady that I could have been is scared and doesn't have a job more, more than or has been put out of a job and can't feed her family and can't pay her bills. And then the track that I've decided to take, luckily my job in agriculture is essential. We have to continue to feed people, we have to continue to ensure people that their food is safe and that there's food for them to eat. And so my life hasn't been impacted very much by coronavirus, which has been a blessing, but it's because of the industry that I'm in. And because farmers and ranchers have to continue forging ahead in order to feed and provide for, for everyone else.

Vance Crowe [00:24:54] A couple of days ago, I, I've started asking people my, my favorite question, which is called the Peter Teal paradox. And that that paradox is what is one thing that you believe that nobody agrees with you on? And the reason this is such an interesting question is because once you ask it, if somebody sits there and they're like, no, I agree with you, you've already failed, but if nobody agrees with you, now you've said something and you have to like dig your way out of that. And so for my, my case that I've been trying to make is that the state of Missouri should look across the Mississippi River and see that Illinois is in big trouble right now. And so they've got a lot of debts. Why don't we just go ahead and buy about 15 miles of East St. Louis coastline and we'll just, we'll just grab it all the way in and we'll take all of that part of Illinois so they could just sell us a part of Illinois that they've kind of left to, to its own devices. Do you have a a, a Peter Teel paradox answer, do you do, what is the thing that you believe that no one else agrees with you on?

Ashlee Mortimer [00:25:59] So you're much more creative than I was when I was thinking about this question. My answer to it because of the position I'm in and my talking to the consumer and being able to share the story of ranchers and farmers. So many people don't think that farmers and ranchers are or have the characteristics that they have and they're, I guess they don't see the story that I'm able to see. So something that I believe that a lot of other people don't believe is that farmers and ranchers are dedicated, passionate, hardworking, amazing people that are growing food and fiber and raising food for American families. And they're doing that through caring for the environment and making sure that the environment and the weather and natural resources in the plants or the animals are all working to mutually benefit each other.

Vance Crowe [00:26:52] And when you look at what's going on around the, the packing plants that we were talking about before, there's a lot of talk about country of origin labeling and some of these other fights. What are things that you wish the public that that wants to be supportive? I think of ranchers, I think when people think of the American rancher, they think that they're on the side of them, but they don't really know what the rancher's side of the story is. So when you hear about MCO or country of origin, origin labeling, what, what, what is the, what is your perspective on it?

Ashlee Mortimer [00:27:24] So in cattle growers and specifically Arizona cattle growers, there is a lot of both sides of the story. People that wanna have country of origin labeling and people that are scared of it and that that's gonna make their, their cost essentially go up. Personally, I like the idea of country of origin labeling. I know that one of the arguments is that it could hurt our trade agreements with Mexico and Canada. And my idea the other day, or my dad and I were talking about it, I'm like, why don't we just do North America labeling? And that way it's all three of us coming together and being more inclusive and collaborating and being better business partners essentially, and having a label for all three of us. So I think it's a lot to work out still. And I'm grateful that President Trump is seeing that farmers and ranchers need his help. And I am glad that he's in the position that he's in so he can help us. And he has a clear sense, I believe, of the different sides of the story. And with everybody having such a big say in a big voice right now in agriculture, it's, it's gonna be exciting to get everybody at the table and really figure out what the best way to move forward is.

Vance Crowe [00:28:49] So you brought up President Trump and right now everybody's talking about coronavirus all the time, but there is an election coming up and the state of Arizona, are you guys under a lockdown right now?

Ashlee Mortimer [00:29:04] We're under a stay at home order, but it's slowly opening back up on Friday. All of our restaurants and retail stores will open. And really for the past few months we haven't had any enforcement on the lockdown order or stay at home order, but everything's opening up on Friday, so that's exciting.

Vance Crowe [00:29:23] Yeah, it was. I, so the other day I don't watch much re like normal television. I, I think like a lot of our generation, I'm always just watching on my computer, but I stumbled through and I saw something on, I don't even remember what show, but it was Trump essentially saying, it's not me that's locking you down, it's your governors and you should be warriors for freedom. And to me that's like, that's a, that's a very stark thing to say, but I see that pressure building that people want the freedom to be able to decide whether or not they go out, whether they wear a mask, whether they spend time in the presence of other people that might have it. What is your sense for Arizona ranchers? Like what's the, what's the ag community thinking about being a warrior for freedom and, and having the ability to go outside?

Ashlee Mortimer [00:30:17] So in large part, ranching and farming, it hasn't changed. We, our daily jobs are going outside and caring for the animals are caring for our plants and we've had to continue to do that. So really in large part besides the prices and the market and the demand are daily lives and our jobs haven't. And I think that there's some people that go to the grocery store ran ranchers wise that decide, oh yeah, lemme wear a mask and lemme go to the grocery store. And other people like myself that are like, I'm not putting one of those on. But I think it comes down to, like you were saying, freedom people. I can go to a grocery store and I can decide for myself if I wanna wear a mask or not. And my 80-year-old grandma can decide the same thing. She can decide if she's gonna go to the grocery store and if she does, she can decide if she's gonna wear a mask or not. And that's what my take on it's is we all have our personal choice and when people start mandating that you have to wear a mask or that you can't have that freedom anymore, I start to worry about that sort of stuff.

Vance Crowe [00:31:19] Yeah, I'm a hundred percent with you. Like, and I don't, it's been difficult for me to have and it's probably 'cause a lot of the conversations that we have now are not face to face. They're in front, they're over Twitter or something. But my sense is like we always have to take risks and we have to make those decisions for ourselves, how we are going to manage that risk. And so when you start having people say, I'm making the decision for you, how much risk I'm willing to let you take because it may impact me, we start getting into a situation where our governance is different than the one that we all signed up for. Like we didn't, you know, and, and in the America we were born into this level of freedom. But I think that you have to always be on guard from people telling you, well, this is just the new normal. There are people that get to decide whether or not you have to wear a mask or not. And I think that the reason that this could lead to a bigger problem than most people expect is let's just imagine that we go three months and then coronavirus tails off and we don't have to wear the mask. But then next year we see that influenza is pretty bad and it would help grandma and the people that have diabetes and high blood pressure if we didn't spread regular flu around. So we just require everybody going into the office to wear masks. I don't wanna live in a society where we have like mask season. This seems ridiculous to me, but it seems entirely possible in a way that it didn't seem entirely possible just a couple of months ago.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:32:47] And that brings in that people are start starting to live by fear. And I don't wanna live by fear. I wanna go through my life and be positive and try to affect good change. And I don't wanna be scared to go outside or scared to eat food or scared not to wear a mask. And really that's where that will push us is to be scared.

Vance Crowe [00:33:07] Yeah. And like I think it's gonna cause all these weird issues about who can see each other like in a neighborhood. So I live in a neighborhood that if you walked around, you might not be able to tell who somebody has in their backyard, but you could definitely tell if there were people in their backyard. And I remember at the beginning of Coronavirus when we hadn't gone into full lockdown mode, I was pretty judgy about like, oh, you're taking your life into your own hands. But it never crossed my mind that people would report on one another that people would say, those people are doing something that I think the government should come and break up. They weren't going and knocking on the door and saying like, Hey, why don't we wrap up this party and everybody go home. They were using the government to do that. And I think that it creates a, a culture inside of your own communities, inside of your own neighborhood that is not good. So I mean, I've taken to setting up a table and chairs out in my driveway in the, in the front so that way anybody walking around, we can stop and talk and start to see each other like the, because the culture of fear where people are sitting inside hiding behind their blinds, nothing good comes from this. It's not productivity. We don't win, we don't bring people together. More all bad things come from people being afraid of one another.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:34:21] Exactly. And it goes, like you were saying that it's not, it's scary when people start judging each other or saying, oh, they're doing it wrong, and then calling the cops and it's like, Hey people, this is my life. And that kind of goes back to the freedom thing of it just sets it up for fear and then people start coming in and judging you and then you're in trouble. And then it's like, hey, this isn't what our country is. And I was watching the news the other day and saw people getting arrested for protesting and I'm like, what in the world that's our right as American citizens to protest and have a voice and to, I know it's just crazy. And I, I'm interested to see what will happen when all this wraps up and all the law cases that I think are gonna come and court cases and all of that side of it of, Hey, did the government have a right to tell us to not open our businesses or did they have a right to arrest us when we were protesting? And so that's gonna be an interesting,

Vance Crowe [00:35:26] And the hardest part about all of it is that it will be water under the bridge, right? People's businesses will already be gone or people that were forced out of the market or the fact that people will not be able to get meat in some cases. What do you think of these meat packing shortages? They're talking about it being from workers that are getting sick in the plants or at home and then going into the plants. What do you think we should be doing about the fact that we need to have workers going into these places in order to be able to have meat and yet it seems like maybe they're in a vulnerable position.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:36:00] So first off, ranchers in general are very thankful for the order that President Trump put into place last week saying that meat packing plants need to stay open. We have to have food in this country and we have to figure out a way to make it happen. And so there's guidelines that are put in place, masks, gloves, protective equipment that the packing plants are using. And I think that that is fabulous and we need to continue doing that. And I was watching one of your podcasts from, I think it was last week or a few weeks ago with one of the packing plants saying that because we now have all of this protective equipment, we don't need to social distance inside of the packing plants. And I personally agree, I think we need to ramp up production, we need to feed our people and we need to make sure that the staff and the employees are safe, but in order to do that, let's, let's take their temperature when they go in and let's make sure that they have the equipment they need to protect themselves while they're creating food for the rest of us.

Vance Crowe [00:37:03] Yeah, and I think that one of the big things that I have discovered in the last few weeks that regular people don't know is the number of calories that are being produced out of a pork packing plant or a beef packing plant is huge. And you can't just go make up those calories by going and having carrots or hummus or black beans. There are a lot of people that are like, Hey, just switch to a vegan diet. But we, we don't have a system set up where we have replaceable calories. I mean, one of the things about meat is that it is a highly calorically dense food. So it means that, that we've compressed a lot of energy for humans to keep going with their day-to-day activities and a small amount of space. Now, I don't think we're in danger of people starving right now, but if you extend this out over a period of time, the calorie deficit can become a real problem in, in this country and and really all over the world,

Ashlee Mortimer [00:37:58] Right? And if really if people switched over to a plant-based diet, then all of that food would start going down. We don't have the facilities in place to produce a upheaval of tons more hummus. And if you're gonna eat, it takes so much more hummus to get the same amount of protein, but you're eating way more calories to get that protein as with beef. So really to me, I definitely am going to stay with beef. I love beef, I love supporting ranchers and I love to support all of the beef community along the way. And I am very thankful that the packing plants are continuing to go and continuing to butcher and process that beef so I can have it for dinner.

Vance Crowe [00:38:45] And so what is something you're buying now during coronavirus that you were not buying in January of 2020?

Ashlee Mortimer [00:38:54] So in whole, my life has not changed very much, but there is, so I don't think that, I couldn't think of anything that I'm buying that I wasn't buying. But there is one thing that I can't buy that I always did buy, and that is dry shampoo because Ulta is closed and I cannot live without my dry shampoo. Is that what

Vance Crowe [00:39:13] Is dry shampoo? I hear about this, but I don't even know what is it.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:39:16] So dry shampoo is if you, I try to go a few days without washing my hair so that it doesn't break, I guess. And so when your hair like scalp starts getting oily, it's a shampoo that you don't have to get your hair wet, you just spray it in your roots and then it absorbs all the oil and cleans your hair without having to get your hair wet. So I went, I go through a lot of dry shampoo, I, I love it. It's one of my favorite things in the world and I can't get it because dang Ulta's still closed. Or maybe they're open now, so I might have to go over and get some if they open this weekend, but I need my dry

Vance Crowe [00:39:52] Shampoo. That's a good answer. I would never have come up with that on my end. So a final question, Ashley, I'm so appreciative that you were willing to do this, but the thing that I find very interesting, and I actually stopped asking people this question for a while because I thought, well, you know, coronavirus is kind of moving on, maybe we're not past this, but now I've discovered like no, things are still changing. And the question is, what do you think the world will look like in two weeks?

Ashlee Mortimer [00:40:19] Oh, it's a hard one because really it's, nobody knows. We could be all open and we could be having people come out of their houses and participate in the economy again, or we could not. And

Vance Crowe [00:40:33] Yeah, but you gotta take a guess. You gotta take a guess.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:40:35] I know, I know. Whew. Okay. So yesterday my mom was telling me that she read a Facebook post that said 40% of people have not changed their lives at all since coronavirus. 20% of people have stayed inside and have changed their lives. And those people are gonna be running out whenever everything opens. And then I think it was 20 other percent said they're gonna, they're gonna be scared still and stay inside. And I can't remember the other percentage what that made up, but I think that's gonna happen. I think that in two weeks everybody's gonna say, Hey, the heck with this, let's go out, let's start buying from our local shops and let's open up the malls and let's continue with life because we're all stuck at home and we're ready to get out. It's like being grounded and then you're like, Hey wait, I'm done being grounded, let's get out and let's continue with what we like to do. So in two weeks, that's what I think's gonna happen.

Vance Crowe [00:41:32] Yeah. All right. That's a good answer. That's bold prediction, so we'll, we'll be able to

Ashlee Mortimer [00:41:36] On it. What do you think?

Vance Crowe [00:41:38] I think it's gonna depend a whole bunch on different states. I think that if there are some states that if they don't or open up, you're gonna see people take more and more aggressive protests because they are sitting there feeling like they're not being heard. And I think that one of the things that the regular media and probably people that are really science-minded are not considering, is that when people are showing up with an aggressive position, like with guns or wearing camo, it's that they feel like they're not being heard and that, and it's that they're like, we want you to take us seriously because our opinion is serious. And you could say, well, they're way too overdramatic. Or that's, you know, like coming in and slamming the door, like nobody should have to pay attention to you. But it doesn't matter. It's a signal that people feel like they're not being heard. So I think in the states that have continued onerous lockdown, I think you're gonna see a big increase in that. And I think you're right. I think, I think in my area you're gonna see more neighborhood barbecues. I think you're gonna see people that are gonna say, Hey, as long as you're not going into work every day and doing crazy things, like we can have an outdoor barbecue and and be fine. And I think people will wade out into that in the next two weeks.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:42:55] I agree.

Vance Crowe [00:42:56] Alright, well Ashley, I am so grateful to have ever met you. We randomly sat next to each other at an Arizona Farm Bureau dinner and which Julie Murphy was a big part of. And man, you're one of those people that if I had to place a bet on, on your future, you could place a very few chips on there and I think you'd win a whole bunch because I, I see a lot of great things for you.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:43:20] Well thank you so much. I really appreciate that.

Vance Crowe [00:43:23] And I will see you in July if I have to drive there, if I have to walk there, I will be there in July. So.

Ashlee Mortimer [00:43:29] Well, we are so excited we're upping to have tons and tons of people, probably 800 attendants or more. And we're excited to get all these ranchers together and to have fun.

Vance Crowe [00:43:40] Alright, well great. It was great talking with you Ashley. We'll talk later. Ah.